TO MOST OF US, the problems of life are not very serious, and we want ready-made answers. We do not want to delve into the problem, we do not want to think it out completely, fully, and understand the whole significance of it, we want to be told the answer, and the more gratifying the answer, the quicker we accept it. When we are made to think about a problem, when we have to go into it, our minds rebel, because we are not used to inquiring into problems.
对于多数人，生活中面临的并非很严重的问题，我们只想索取现成答案，并不想深入，不想全面、彻底地把问题想明白，进而领悟问题的全部意义；我们只想获得答案，而且答案越舒心，则接受得越利索。而当我们被迫深入思考、探索问题时，则会因为不习惯而心生抗拒。
In considering these questions, if you merely wait for a ready-made answer from me, I am afraid you will be disappointed; but if we can go into the question together, think it out anew, not according to old patterns, then perhaps we shall be able to solve the many problems which confront us, and which we are usually so unwilling to look at. We have to look at them, that is, there must be the capacity to face the fact; and we cannot face the fact, whatever it be, as long as we have explanations, as long as words fill our minds.
当思考这些问题时，如果你只是期待我给出现成答案，恐怕我会让你失望。但如果我们能共同深入问题，不墨守成规，重新悟透问题，或许能化解我们所面临的诸多不愿正视的问题。我们必须直面问题，亦即，我们必须具有面对事实的能力。但，只要我们热衷于解释，只要各种说辞充塞大脑，我们就不能直面事实。
It is words, explanations, memories, that cloud the understanding of the fact. The fact is always new, because the fact is a challenge; but the fact ceases to be a challenge, it is not new, when we consider it merely as the old and discard it. So, in considering these questions, I hope you and I will think out the problem together. I am not laying down the answer, but we are going to think out each problem together and discover the truth of it.
恰是这些言辞、解释、记忆，蒙蔽了我们对事实的领悟力。现实是常新的，现实就是挑战。但当我们把现实视为老一套，并弃若敝屣，现实就不再是全新挑战。所以，希望你我共同思考这些问题，并非由我给出答案，而是我们一同思考每一个问题，发现问题的真相。
Questioner: You are preaching a kind of philosophical anarchism, which is the favorite escape of the highbrow intellectuals. Will not a community always need some form of regulation and authority? What social order could express the values you are upholding?
问：你在鼓吹某种无政府主义哲学，这是卖弄学问的知识分子们最喜欢的逃避术。难道一个社群不需要某种法规和权威吗？什么样的社会秩序才能体现你所持的价值观？
Krishnamurti: Sir, when life is very difficult, when problems are increasing, we escape either through the intellect or through mysticism. We know the escape through the intellect: rationalization, more and more cunning devices, more and more technique, more and more economic responses to life, all very subtle and intellectual. And there is the escape through mysticism, through the sacred books, through worshiping an established idea—idea being an image, a symbol, a superior entity, or what you will—thinking that it is not of the mind; but both the intellectual and the mystic are products of the mind.
克：先生，生活如此艰难，问题与日俱增，于是我们通过智力或神秘主义来逃避。我们都懂得智力逃避术：自我文饰、狡黠心机、层出不穷的技巧、运用经济手段来应对生活，且乐此不疲，所有这些都精妙非常，智力十足。此外还有神秘主义的逃避术、神圣经卷、崇拜国教理念——所谓理念可能是一尊偶像、一个符号、一个超级体，等等——你认为都是超越心智之物。但无论智力逃避，还是神秘主义逃避，其实都是心智造作的产物。
One we call the intellectual highbrow, and the other we despise, because it is the fashion now to despise the mystic, to kick him out; but both function through the mind. The intellectual may be able to talk, to express himself more clearly, but he too withdraws himself into his own ideas and lives there quietly, disregarding society and pursuing his illusions, which are born of the mind; so I do not think there is any difference between the two. They are both pursuing illusions of the mind, and neither the highbrow nor the lowbrow, neither the mystic, the yogi who escapes, withdraws from the world, nor the commissar, has the answer.
我们景仰多智博学之士，对其他人则不屑一顾，因为当下的时尚是蔑视、排斥神秘主义者，但这两种人其实都是以心智而行于世上。智力卓越的人可能健谈，能更清晰地表达自己，但他也喜欢遁入理念，静静地活在理念世界，无视真实的社会，追逐心智编织的幻象。所以我认为这两类人没有什么区别，他们都在追逐心头的幻象。无论饱学鸿儒，还是浅俗之徒，无论是逃避红尘的神秘士、瑜伽士，还是世间的政治人物，都给不出问题的答案。
It is you and I, ordinary common people, who have to solve this problem without being highbrow or mystical, without escaping either through rationalization, or through vague terms and getting hypnotized by words, by methods of our own self-projection.
恰恰是你我这些普通人，必须解决这一问题。我们既不是博学之士，也不是神秘高人；既不能遁入智力的自我文饰中，也不能通过神秘主义的模糊术语、通过各种说辞、通过自我投射法来催眠自己，从而逃避现实。
What you are the world is, and unless you understand yourself, what you create will always increase confusion and misery; but the understanding of yourself is not a process through which you have to go in order to act. It is not that you must first understand yourself and then act; on the contrary the understanding of yourself is in the very action of relationship. Action is relationship in which you understand yourself, in which you see yourself clearly; but if you wait to become perfect or to understand yourself, that waiting is dying. Most of us have been active, and that activity has left us empty, dry; and once we have been bitten, we wait and do not act further, because we say, "I won't act until I understand."
我们的内在是什么面目，世界就呈现什么样貌。除非你理解了自己，否则你的造作只能为世界增加混乱和苦难。但理解自己，并不是先经历再付诸行动的过程。并非你必须首先理解自己，然后才能行动；相反，理解自我，与关系中的所言所行是同一的。行动，就是关系，你从中觉悟自我，看清自己的真面目。但，如果你等待自己完美或觉悟自我后，才付诸行动，那么这种守株待兔就是走向死亡。我们多数人都曾跃跃欲试，但一度的活跃为我们留下的是空虚与枯萎；一朝被蛇咬，我们便惯于等待，裹足不前，因为我们发誓：“觉悟之前，我绝不妄动！”
Waiting to understand is a process of death; but if you understand the whole problem of action, of living from moment to moment, which does not demand waiting, then understanding is in what you are doing, it is in action itself, it is not separate from living. Living is action, living is relationship, and because we do not understand relationship, because we avoid relationship, we are caught in words; and words have mesmerized us into action that leads to further chaos and misery.
坐等觉悟，就是走向死亡。但如果你明白了行动的所全部问题，明白了觉悟就是时时刻刻活在当下，并不需要等待，那么觉悟就在你当下的一言一行中，就在行动中，与生活一体不可分。生活就是行动，就是关系；因为我们不理解关系，总逃避关系，所以我们被文字所困缚，各种说辞将我们迷幻，鼓动我们的行动，进而导致更多的混乱与苦难。
Q: Will not a community always need some form of regulation and authority?
问：难道难道一个社群不需要某种法规和权威吗？
K: Obviously there must be authority as long as a community is based on violence. Is not our present social structure based on violence, on intolerance? The community is you and another in relationship; and is not your relationship based on violence? Are you not ultimately out for yourself? Is not our present relationship based on violence—violence being the process of self-enclosure, isolation? Is not our daily action a process of isolation? And since each one is isolating himself, there must be authority to bring about cohesion, either the authority of the state, or the authority of organized religion.
克：显然，只要社群建立在暴力之上，则必定存在权威。我们目前的社会结构不就是建立在暴力和不宽容基础之上的吗？社群，就是关系中的你与他，你们的关系不就是建立在暴力之上的吗？你最终不就是谋求私利吗？当前我们的关系不正是以暴力为基础的吗？所谓暴力，不就是自我封闭、自我孤立吗？我们的日常活动不正是自我孤立的过程吗？因为人人都自我孤立，必然有权威出来，产生凝聚力，要么是国家权威，要么是宗教组织权威。
To the extent that we have been held together at all, we have been held so far through fear of religion or through fear of government; but a man who understands relationship, whose life is not based on violence, has no need for authority. The man who needs authority is the stupid man, the violent man, the unhappy man—which is yourself.
在某种程度上，迄今为止我们之所以团结在一起，是出于对宗教或对政府的恐惧；但一个理解关系的人，他的生活不以暴力为基础，故而不需要权威。凡需求权威的人，是愚蠢的人，暴力的人，不快乐的人——这就是你自己。
You seek authority because you think that without it you are lost; that is why you have all these religions, illusions, and beliefs, that is why you have innumerable leaders, political as well as religious. In moments of confusion you produce the leader, and that leader you follow; and since he is the outcome of your own confusion, obviously the leader himself must be confused. So, authority is necessary as long as you are producing conflict, misery, and violence in your relationships.
你之所以追寻权威，是因为你认为离开权威你就会迷失；你之所以信仰宗教、幻象和信仰，你之所以拥有无数政治和宗教领袖，这就是原因所在。 在困惑时刻，你制造出领袖并追随之；因为领袖是你内心的困惑编织出来的，显然领袖本人也必然同样困惑。所以，只要你在关系中不断制造冲突、痛苦与暴力，你就需要权威。
Q: What social order could express the values you are upholding?
问：什么样的社会秩序能够体现你所抱持的价值观？
K: Sir, do you understand what values I am upholding? Am I upholding anything—at least, for those few who have listened with serious intention? I am not giving you a new set of values for an old set of values, I am not giving you a substitution; but I say: look at the very things that you hold, examine them, search out their truth, and the values that you then establish will create the new society. It is not for somebody else to draw up a blueprint which you can follow blindly without knowing what it is all about, but it is for you to find out for yourself the value, the truth of each problem.
克：先生，你了解我持有什么价值观吗？一直真诚聆听我的老几位，我是不是抱持着什么价值观？实际上，我没有塞给你们一套新价值观，来换掉旧的，我不是让你替换价值观；我要说的是：审视你所抱持的东西，省察并发现其真相，然后你所建立的价值观将创造出全新的社会。并不是由别人为你勾画蓝图，你一无所知却盲目追随，而是由你自己探究每一个问题的价值与真相。
What I am saying is very clear and simple if you will follow it. Society is your own product, it is your projection. The world's problem is your problem, and to understand that problem you have to understand yourself; and you can understand yourself only in relationship, not in escapes. Because you escape through them, your religion, your knowledge have no validity, no significance. You are unwilling to alter fundamentally your relationship with another because that means trouble, that means disturbance, revolution; so you talk about the highbrow intellectual, the mystic, and all the rest of that nonsense.
我的话非常清晰、简单，只要你能听明白。世界，是你的作品，是你的投影。世界的问题，就是你的问题。欲理解世界问题，你必须理解自己，而你只能在关系中理解自己，而非在逃避中。你通过宗教、知识来逃避，所以你的宗教与知识毫无生命力，毫无意义。你不情愿从根本上改变与他人的关系，因为那意味着烦恼、混乱、翻覆，所以你高谈文人雅士，阔论神秘玄幻客，诸如此类的劳什子。
A new society, a new order, cannot be established by another; it must be established by you. A revolution based on an idea is not a revolution at all. Real revolution comes from within, and that revolution is not brought about through escape, but comes only when you understand your relationships, your daily activities, the way you are acting, the way you are thinking, the way you are talking, your attitude to your neighbor, to your wife, to your husband, to your children. Without understanding yourself, whatever you do, however far you may escape will only produce more misery, more wars, more destruction.
11. Bombay, 4th public talk, 5 March 1950
全新的社会，全新的秩序，不能由他人为你建立，而必须由你自己建立。建立在理念之上的变革，根本不是真正的变革。真正的变革发自内心，而不是生于逃避；唯有你理解了你的关系、日常活动、行为方式、思维方式、言谈方式、对邻居、太太、丈夫和孩子的心态，心灵变革才产生。若无自知，无论你做了什么，无论你逃避多远，那只能产生更多的苦难、战争与毁灭。
（1950年3月5日孟买第四次公开讲谈）
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